FULL TRANSCRIPT: Mitt Romney's Interview on Fox News Sunday
In a Sunday show exclusive, GOP contender Mitt Romney sat down with Chris Wallace on Fox News Sunday. Read the full transcript below and watch the interview at 2p and 6p ET today on Fox News Channel.
CHRIS WALLACE, HOST: Governor Romney, at long last, welcome back to Fox News Sunday.
FORMER GOV. MITT ROMNEY, R-MASS., PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Thanks, Chris. Good to be with you.
WALLACE: I saw the other day that President Obama has not met with Republican Congressional leaders in five months while he has, at the same time, made 34 campaign speeches. What's your basic argument running against him?
What's the choice for voters?
ROMNEY: Well, as you described in that introduction, the choice is, as it relates to that style is that leaders don't do that. Leaders actually spend time meeting with people on the other side of the aisle, understand their needs, understand their concerns, get their input and look for some way to find common ground. Not to violate their own principles or for instance the opposition to violate his principles, but instead finding places where there's common ground on which to build.
And this president, instead, has gone to the people and attacked. It's been a constant attack either against Republicans or against people in the business world or whatever group he somehow feels is opposed to his agenda.
The right course for any leader is work to work with other people. Good Democrats love America, good Republicans love America. We need a leader who understands not just the words of unity but the practice of building unity.
WALLACE: On the one hand, the president says he rescued the country from the great -- another Great Depression, he killed Osama bin Laden, and he said you and your party would restore policies that caused the financial meltdown in the first place.
ROMNEY: It's great rhetoric. But, again it's just -- it's hollow.
First of all, he was not the reason that the economy hit bottom and then begins to recover. We -- we have gone through recessions before. He made this one worse, and he made the recovery more tepid.
I -- I get the chance to speak with business leaders, big and small businesses, largely small, and I say to them, do any of you believe that the policies of this administration have helped you be more successful in your enterprise and hire more people? I don't see a single hand go up when I ask that to an audience. His policies have hurt, not helped.
With regards to Osama bin Laden, we're delighted that he gave the order, take out Osama bin Laden. Any president would have done that, but this one did and that's a good thing.
I'm not going to say everything he's done is wrong, but with regards to the economy, almost everything he's done made it more difficult for this economy to reboot.
WALLACE: Before you face the president, of course, you have to win the Republican nomination and you have, in recent days, been escalating your attacks against your main competitor in the polls, Speaker Gingrich. You now say he's zany, he's an unreliable leader in the conservative world, he lacks the temperament.
What's your basic argument against Newt Gingrich?
ROMNEY: Well, we're different and a campaign is about pointing out differences.
I mean, for instance, the great issue that has been brought before this Congress, with the new Republican Congress, is are we going to deal with entitlement reform or not. And Republicans came together and proposed a program to make sure that Medicare is sustainable. Paul Ryan was the author of the plan, but almost every single Republican in Congress voted for it. And -- and the world watched to see, OK, are we going to have progress. And the speaker said this is right-wing social engineering. This -- talk about unreliable. At a critical time, he -- he cut the legs out from underneath a very important message.
The same -- the same was true with regards to cap and trade. This was being battled on Capitol Hill and the speaker sat down with Nancy Pelosi and spoke in favor of legislation dealing with climate change. He has been unreliable in those settings.
And zany, I don't think you would call mirrors in space to light highways at night particularly practical, or a lunar colony a practical idea, not at a stage like this.
WALLACE: Are you prepared for a long, bitter primary battle all the way to the convention?
ROMNEY: I -- I hope we don't have that, but my guess is that -- that's certainly a possibility.
We -- we now have adapted the Democratic Party's approach for allocating the -- the early delegates on a proportional basis. And we watched what happened when the Democrats did that. Their primary process went on for a long, long time.
So we are prepared. If we go on for -- for months and months, we will have the resources to -- to carry a campaign to each of the states, but we'll decide who gets delegates and who becomes the nominee.
WALLACE: One of the knocks against you is that at a time when Republican voters want dramatic change, that you are offering fine tuning. Let's start with taxes.
Rick Perry called for a 20 percent flat tax. Newt Gingrich has a 15 percent plan. You would keep the top tax rate at 35 percent. And in contrast to most of your rivals, would not lower the tax on capital gains and dividends for anyone making more than $200,000 a year.
Question: Aren't you basically right there with Barack Obama, the rich should pay more?
ROMNEY: No, I'm saying don’t raise taxes on anyone. I want to make sure that with the precious dollars we have, if we can provide the tax relief, that those dollars go to middle-income Americans.
The people that have been hurt in the Obama economy are -- are not the wealthy. The wealthy are doing just fine. The people that have been hurt are people in the middle class.
And so I focus the -- those precious dollars that we have -- I focus that on the middle class. I want --
WALLACE: But what's wrong with a 15 percent flat tax or the 20 percent flat tax? You're keeping the current rate for the wealthy as 35 percent?
ROMNEY: Look, I would love to see a -- a tax system which brings down rates, which is a more broad-based tax system, which eliminates some of the deductions and exemptions. The Bowles-Simpson plan, for instance, I think, had a lot to speak for. And -- and I'll -- I'll work on a plan of that nature.
The policies I've seen so far that have been put forward of that nature have represented dramatic reductions in taxes for the very highest income people, and I'm not looking to dramatically reduce taxes for the wealthiest in our society. Not that there's anything wrong with being wealthy. I'm pleased to have done well myself. You understand that, others do.
But my -- my intent in running for president is to help middle-income Americans, and a plan that dramatically cuts taxes for the very, very wealthiest, in my opinion, is not the right course.
WALLACE: You talk about helping the middle class, but your plan, that would eliminate the tax on capital gains and dividends doesn't help them. A recent study shows that a family making $75,000 a year in terms of what they would receive by eliminating capital gains dividends, $167.
ROMNEY: Well, first of all, $167 is not zero. And number two, one of the reasons people don't save their money is that they don't see an incentive to do so. They put it in Roth IRAs and keyo plans and they have to put together these nanny programs to try and save money in a tax-advantage basis.
What I do is allow middle-income families to finally be able to save their money tax free. No tax in interest dividends on capital gains for middle-income Americans.
WALLACE: But the argument is middle-class people can't afford, they dont have enough money, to have a lot of capital gains and dividends.
ROMNEY: Look, I recognize that it's not a huge tax cut. It is a tax reduction and it allows middle-income folks to participate in making a brighter future for themselves and for saving. And you're going to find in this country that if there's no tax on savings, middle-income people are going to take advantage of that and save for college, to save for retirement, to save for things that they want.
And saying look, let's provide that same break to the high-income people, that costs a lot of money and it's really not a tax cut that's needed there.
WALLACE: All right, then there's spending. Ron Paul says that he would cut federal spending $1 trillion in the first year. Rick Perry says he can cut the federal budget a quarter of it each year. You say that you would cut $500 billion in 2016.
Again, if a voter wants dramatic change, and that's what they say that they want, why wouldn't they go for one of your rivals instead of you?
ROMNEY: Well, my plan is a responsible plan and I have the specifics that show how I will cut $500 billion out of the federal budget and take federal spending from 25 percent of GDP down to 20 percent of the GDP, which is, in my view, closer to the long-range average and make sense.
Those that have said, look, we're going to get rid of double that amount, I want to see the specifics and look to see whether that would, in fact, hurt the economy and make it harder for us to -- to put people back to work.
My highest priority is to get Americans back to work and that we have rising incomes again, and that we have a deficit reduction program in place that convinces the world that we're on track to have a balanced budget.
I want to cut federal spending, I want to cap federal spending at 20 percent of the GDP and then lower it from there, and ultimately, I want to have a balanced budget amendment.
WALLACE: All right, let's -- let's pick up on this.
Between them, Rick Perry, Ron Paul eliminate five cabinet level departments, including Energy and Education. You would not eliminate any. Why not?
ROMNEY: Well, it's not that I won't eliminate any, I'm just going to make sure we study them in some depth to decide which agencies we ultimately combine.
I think sometimes people think if we eliminate an agency we're not going to keep doing anything it does. The Department of Education, for instance, provides funding for the education of disabled children. I don't imagine that either of those who would talk about getting rid of that department are planning on no longer helping in the education of disabled children. So we need to look and say, given the fact that that function is going to go on, where would it reside.
Some of the responsibility that are happening in these agencies will continue and some I'll eliminate. Some programs I'll eliminate. My list of programs to eliminate is pretty long.
WALLACE: I want to pick up on that because, now, let's look at it from the Democrats' point of view if you end up as the nominee, because they're also going to attack your budget just exactly the other way.
You say that you would push, it says on your website, one of your goals, pass the House plan, Congressman Paul Ryan's plan to cut the budget. Let's look into that.
Cut Medicaid, health coverage for the poor, by $700 billion. Cut food stamps by $127 billion. Cut Pell Grants for low income college students in half. You would cut all these programs, Governor, that people depend on, and a lot more than that.
ROMNEY: Actually, the great news about those programs is that, in the Ryan plan and in the plan I've put forward, I take a program, the biggest of those, which is Medicaid, I take the Medicaid dollars, send them back to the states without the mandates as to how they have to treat how many people --
WALLACE: But you're also cutting the budget by $700 billion.
ROMNEY: Well, what I do is I take the money, send it back to the states and say we're going to grow that funding at inflation, the CPI, plus one percent. By doing that, you save an enormous amount of money.
I happen to believe the states can do a better job, caring for their own poor, by rooting out the fraud and waste and abuse that exists within those programs --
WALLACE: But you don't think if you cut $700 billion in aid to the states, that some people are going to get hurt?
ROMNEY: In the same that by cutting welfare spending dramatically, I don't think we hurt the poor. In the same way, I think cutting Medicaid spending by having it go to the states, run more efficiently with less fraud I don't think will help the people -- will hurt the people that depend on that program for their health care.
WALLACE: Well, I want to pursue it, because I think this is, if you end up against Barack Obama -- really, one of the central issues -- the president said that he is going to campaign as the champion of the middle class, and the Republican nominee, whoever it is, as pushing tax cuts for the wealthy, spending cuts to the poor, and rolling back regulations that help protect people and the environment, aren’t you vulnerable.
ROMNEY: I think he's extraordinarily vulnerable, because we'll say, "How did that work, Mr. President? Your four years in office, just how well did those programs work? Did the poverty decline in this country? Did it go up? It went up.
Joblessness, you came into office and said let me borrow $787 billion and I'll keep unemployment below 8 percent, which itself was an extraordinarily high number. And he hasn't been below 8 percent since.
His policies have not worked. His -- we need regulation, for instance, as you point out. We need regulation in our society. I'm not someone who says get rid of all regulation. We just need regulation that's updated and modern, and that encourages enterprise as opposed to burdening it.
His great failing is he does not understand how this economy works and how his policies have made it harder for this economy to put Americans back to work.
I do know how the economy works, and my policies are designed to get people what they desperately want, not care for being poor. They want to stop being poor, have a good job, and have a bright future.
WALLACE: In your last book, you repeatedly talk about creative destruction, the idea of creative destruction of capitalism. First of all, what does that mean, creative destruction?
ROMNEY: Well, it's an unfortunate, but in some respects, essential part of free enterprise, and the example I use in my book is when someone came up with inventing the tractor, it destroyed a lot of jobs. It destroyed many enterprises that people in the horse-drawn plow business went out of business.
And yet, the wealth of the American people and the well-being of the American people grew dramatically.
Invention, whether of a new product or a new technique or a new design, invention tends to put some enterprises out of business, and encourage other businesses to become more successful with the -- with the outcome that the entire society becomes better off.
WALLACE: Let me present the other side of the argument, not to say that we don't want progress, obviously we do. What about the people who get hurt in that process, and who lose their jobs, maybe lose their family? What about that?
ROMNEY: Well -- and that's why in a productive society, you have new invention coming along, and people move to those new enterprises. I'm sure, for instance, when the automobile came on the scene and tractors came on the scene, it was actually slightly before my time when that occurred --
WALLACE: Even mine.
ROMNEY: -- yeah. When that occurred, a lot of people did lose jobs, and it had to be heart-wrenching. And you have to have a setting which allows people to get trained for the new positions, a safety net to make sure people are not on the streets, I mean, that's an essential part of a free enterprise system as well, where there will be businesses that go out of business to get people into the new opportunities. And that happens.
If we -- someone said to me, you know, "How could you create millions and millions of jobs overnight?" Make tractors illegal. Say to farmers, "You have to uses horses and plows again." Why, we’d put everybody to work. We'd just be extraordinarily poor.
WALLACE: What if President Obama goes after you as Gordon Gecko, Greed is good?
ROMNEY: Of course he will, in part because he’s been the great divider. This is the president who goes after anybody who's successful. And by the way, he's pretty successful, too. He's done very, very well over the last several years.
And we'll get into it in some depth, and I'll point out that, in my experience in the private sector, and in the investments that I've made, in the businesses I helped to build, our intent in every case was to either help people realize their dreams by starting a business, or taking a business that was failing or underperforming and making it more successful.
My business was not buying things, taking them apart, closing them down. My business was associated with trying to make enterprises more successful. Not always was I able to succeed, but in each case, we tried to grow an enterprise, and in doing so, hopefully provide a better future for those that are associated with that enterprise.
WALLACE: Let's pick up on Bain, where you worked for 25 years, and you say that's what sets you apart. You have worked in the real private sector and you have created jobs. There have been some big successes, Staples, now you help start it. They now employ 90,000 people.
On the other hand, we saw that four of the 10 top-dollar investments you made went bankrupt. Is that just the cost of doing business?
ROMNEY: Well, it's not just the cost, it's the downside, it's the reality of what life is like in the private sector, which is that businesses that you invest in -- those are not enterprises that I ran, of course, but in businesses that you invest in...
WALLACE: GS Industries, Date International.
ROMNEY: Right, and a company like GS Industries, its -- it was a group of steel mills, and I think we were an investor in that business for, I don't know, eight years or so. It finally went bankrupt after I'd left the firm -- it was an investment that was made again, I wasn't running it. But the steel industry got in trouble in this country. I think 40 mills went bankrupt the same time it did, in part, because of -- well, in this case, dumping from places like China into this country. I understand the impact of what happens globally in trade, and businesses, you know, lose and go out of business and in some cases, lose jobs. It breaks your heart when that happens. It also loses investment. And by the way, you probably know this, but dollars in Bain Capital weren't my dollars. They came from endowments and even a church pension fund was in -- not my church, but was invested in Bain Capital, and that money goes to them. And when we suffer losses, they're the ones that suffer the losses, as well.
WALLACE: You talk about the money. Back when you were in Bain Capital, you and your partners took a picture, with money literally coming out of your pockets, coming out of your jackets. And you know that, as you talk about Gordon Gecko, the Democrats are behind you, that picture against you. What's the story about that?
ROMNEY: Already have and will. That was at the closing of our very first fund. We went out as a group of folks, said, you know, I wonder if we can raise money from other people to organize a company, we can get capital from others that will allow us to begin a business that will be successful. And we went out and raised money. We were successful in raising our first fund; it was about $37 million, an extraordinarily large amount of money that we raised from other people. And we posed for a picture, just celebrating the fact that we'd raised a lot of money and then we hoped to be able to return it with a good return.
And in the interim, of course, we'd have to be successful, build enterprises. That first fund got invested in a number of businesses that turned out to create a lot of jobs and yielded a very positive return to the people who’d entrusted us with their funds.
But I know that'll be used. I know that. That's -- it'll be fun. I recognize, the president's going to go after me. I'll go after him.
WALLACE: And if he says -- or somebody says, maybe it’s an independent group, fat cat, hard-hearted, you know, let businesses rise, he makes money; businesses fall, sometimes he still make money.
ROMNEY: You know, I know that there's going to be every effort to put free enterprise on trial and to attack free enterprise, to attack people who work in free enterprise, to attack those who believe that profit is good. A profit in an enterprise is better than loss. Loss means jobs are going to be lost. You hope or I hope to see General Motors as a profitable and successful enterprise again, so that jobs can be spared.
You know, I mentioned the other night, the president has had one experience overseeing an enterprise. A couple of enterprises, General Motors and Chrysler. What did he do? He closed factories. He laid off people. He didn't do it personally, but his people did. Why did he do that? Because he wanted to save the enterprise. And he wants to make it -- get it profitable so it can survive. A profit in enterprise is essential to keep it alive and to keep people employed.
WALLACE: The individual mandate in RomneyCare. You say that the reason for it was to deal with free riders, those folks who didn't have insurance, who just show up when they were sick in an emergency rooms, get treatment, that all the rest of us, through taxes or our heightened premiums, have to pay for. But free riders are not just a Massachusetts problem. Is the individual mandate, telling people they have to get health insurance, is that a good idea? Do you agree that it's a good idea for other states?
ROMNEY: Well, there are various ways to encourage people to have insurance if they can afford it, and we put in place a plan that was politically possible in our state, which some call an individual mandate. It is an individual mandate.
There are various ways of encouraging that. Another alternative would be to say we're going to give a tax break to people who do have insurance, and you're going to lose that break if you don't have insurance. That was something--
WALLACE: But do you think that's a good idea for other states to do?
ROMNEY: I'm not going to try and tell other states what to do. Some states have said, look, we're going to care for our uninsured or our poor, by having clinics that they can go to to get care. There are various models. They’ll get compared.
And if the Massachusetts model works, other states will adopt it. If it doesn't, Massachusetts itself will probably give it up.
WALLACE: All right. The reason I ask -- and you say you don't -- you're not going to tell other states. Back in December of 2004, almost exactly four years ago today, you were talking with Tim Russert on "Meet the Press," and you said you thought it was -- would be a terrific idea if other states went for the individual mandate. You said this: “Those who follow the path that we pursued will find it's the best path, and will end up with a nation that's taken a mandate approach.”
Do you stand by that -- on a state level, not a federal level -- a mandate approach?
ROMNEY: Look, I like what our state did. It was right for our state. Im going to let other states pursue their paths, as they think make the most sense.
WALLACE: But that’s not what you said four years ago.
ROMNEY: As they think they make the most sense. I like what we did. I'm proud of what we did. I'm not going to tell Texas what Texas has to do, or California or New York. I think the ideas that we put forth work. We'll see which parts of them work and which don't. But I -- I'm not, as President of the United States, going to do what this president did, which is to impose his will on the entire nation. The 10th Amendment says states could craft their own plans, if they like what they see -- and I think ours is a model that they can look at and take pieces of, try it, improve upon it. If they like what they see, they'll -- they'll -- they'll use it. If they don't , why, they’ll use something better.
WALLACE: Governor Romney, we have to take a break here.
But when we come back, we're going to talk some foreign policy and I'm also going to try to persuade the governor to get personal.
Back in a moment.
WALLACE: And we're back now with Governor Mitt Romney.
Governor, the final U.S. troops are leaving Iraq over the next two weeks.
A couple of questions.
First of all, looking back -- and hindsight is always 20-20 -- should we have invaded?
And, secondly -- big picture -- what should we have done differently over the nine years?
ROMNEY: Oh, boy, that's a -- that's a big question. And going back and trying to say, given what we know now, what would we have done, would we have invaded or not, at the time, we didn't have the knowledge that we have now.
At the time, Saddam Hussein was hiding. He was not letting the inspectors from the United Nations into the various places that they wanted to go. The IAEA was blocked from going into the palaces and so forth. And the intelligence in our nation and other nations was that this -- that this tyrant had weapons of mass destruction. And in the light of that belief, we took action which was appropriate at the time.
Lessons learned along the way? Boy, I, you know, I think our military would say a lot of lessons learned. We probably should have gone in -- going in with a heavier footprint. I think there was a sense that when on the ship it said mission accomplished, that the mission had been accomplished. Turns out it was just getting started, and we had to pursue a surge very late in the process. The surge was successful.
And fortunately we’ve now been able to pull our troops out. We're, of course, very happy to see our troops come out, but I think you're going to see another lesson learned. And I think we're going to find that this president, by not putting in place a status of forces agreement, with the Iraqi leadership, has pulled our troops out in a precipitous way, and we should have left 10, 20, 30,000 personnel there to help transition to the Iraqis’ own military capabilities.
I'm very concerned in this setting. I hope it works out.
ROMNEY: But I’m concerned this…
WALLACE: Let me pick it up right there.
ROMNEY: Yes, yes.
WALLACE: If you become the president, it's going to be your problem, sir. There is a concern, particularly about rolling Iranian influence inside Iraq.
WALLACE: As president, would you send U.S. troops back into Iraq?
ROMNEY: Let me tell you, Chris, I think the decision to send U.S. troops into a combat setting is a very high threshold decision. This is not something you do easily. You don’t -- you don’t send our troops around the world every time there's something that goes off…
WALLACE: I know, but…
ROMNEY: … in an untoward way.
WALLACE: … 4,500 American troops killed, 30,000 wounded, hundreds of billions of dollars that now the Iranians could get if begin to take over, are you going to say well, that’s…?
ROMNEY: I'm not going to say where I would send troops and not send troops. We send troops where there’s a substantial U.S. interest involved. And I have a very high threshold as to a decision where we send our troops. The real issue of the time, I think as it relates to Iran, is their nuclear program and making sure that we dissuade them from taking action that would put the entire world in jeopardy.
WALLACE: In the time we have left, I want to get personal with you, if I may -- don’t get scared.
WALLACE: Your dad, George Romney, ran for president in 1968, and he was one of the frontrunners until he famously said that he got a brainwashing from the generals in Vietnam and that kind of ended his candidacy.
First of all, how old were you when that happened?
And, secondly, how did you feel? Did it hurt to see your dad, who I know you admired so greatly, and who was a fairly distinguished man, become kind of a national punching?
ROMNEY: Yes, of course. I was -- I was probably 20 or 21. I was serving my church at the time overseas. And yet I got the newspaper clipping and so forth.
Was it disappointing? Yeah. Years later, when my dad was proven to be right in terms of the errors in Vietnam, my wife asked him, you know, Dad, you know, how do you feel about the fact that you’re finally being vindicated in what you said? And he said, you know, I never look back. I look forward. He was quite a guy.
WALLACE: The rap against you – you’ve heard, I’m not saying anything you haven’t heard, Governor, you’re robotic, that you don't -- that you don’t let voters inside to know who you really are and what you really feel.
First of all, you think that’s fair?
ROMNEY: You know, anything’s fair in this world. The good news is that the people who see me in town meetings that actually meet me and spend some time with me have a different impression.
WALLACE: Do you feel, it's hard for you to kind of open up, to be emotional?
ROMNEY: Not in the slightest. I think people who know me and who interact with me understand I'm an emotional guy, that I have very deep feelings about the country, a very great concern about the way it's being guided at this time by our president. And so as people get to know me better, I think they'll come to a different impression.
WALLACE: Your campaign has now put your wife, Ann, out on the trail, some say to humanize you. How would you describe your relationship? Are you sweethearts? Are you partners? Are you best friends?
ROMNEY: All three. I mean, Ann and I fell in love when we were in high school. It doesn't happen to a lot of people. You know, she was 15 years old when I really took notice of her. And I was a senior; she was a sophomore. I gave her a ride home from a party. She’d come with someone else. I kissed her at the door and I've been -- you know, I've been following her ever since. She's a remarkable woman. And she's gone through some tough times. She had a diagnosis of MS, she's had breast cancer. And my feelings and passion for Ann haven't changed in the slightest over the years, other than to become stronger.
WALLACE: She says that when she got that diagnosis, the two of you were in the room together when the doctor told her, that she felt -- she felt as if her life were over and that you both cried. How tough a moment was that?
ROMNEY: Probably the toughest time in my life was standing there with Ann as we hugged each other and the diagnosis came. And I was afraid it was Lou Gehrig's disease. As we came into the doctor's office, the brochures on his table there were Lou Gehrig's, ALS and multiple sclerosis. And he did these neurological tests and then he -- and we could see that she had real balance problems. And she didn’t have feeling in places she should have feeling, and he stepped out of the room and we stood up and hugged each other. And I said to her, as long as it's not something fatal, I’m just fine.
But I'm -- look, I’m happy in life as long as I've got my soul mate with me. And Ann is. And she, fortunately, has been able to recover the great majority of her health. But, you know, this marriage thing, it's about bringing two people together in a way that nothing else compares with.
WALLACE: But how did you convince her and how did you convince yourself, because, you know, you must have thought this isn’t only a change for her, it’s a change for us, that you could get through it?
ROMNEY: Well, you know, she knows how she feels about me. She feels the same way about me, I hope, as I feel about her. And she knows that if I were to be afflicted with some kind of condition at some point, that she would feel the same way about me.
And, you know, I said to her, look -- I mean she said I can’t cook any more. I mean, she was -- this was a really difficult time. At the time the disease was diagnosed, it was really tough for her. She -- we were getting ready to look at putting an elevator in the house to get her up to the second floor. We were thinking about a wheelchair for her down the road. I mean, we’re talking about a dramatic change in life. She was tired all the time. She couldn't take care of the family in the way she had in the past. And a lot of that was what gave meaning to her, you know, day-to-day activities. And I said, look, I don't care what the meals are like. You know, I like cold cereal and peanut butter sandwiches. We could do fine with that as long as we have each other. And if you think about what makes a difference to you in your life, it's people. Life is all about the people you love. And you know, I -- we can handle disease. Death, that’s a different matter. Death, I don't know that I can handle death. Disease and hardship, we can handle as long as we have the people we love around us.
WALLACE: Governor Romney, I want to thank you so much for talking with us today. Good luck on the campaign trail. We will see you, and safe travels.
ROMNEY: Thanks, Chris. Good to be with you.